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  1. - Top - End - #31
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    I'm pretty sure Magic Missile can vary from person to person. My party's blue- and gem-obsessed gnome Cleric/Sorcerer/PrC shoots bright blue darts.

  2. - Top - End - #32
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by paddyfool View Post
    You guys do all know that the IME of Goblins and the individually-associated colour coding of OOTS are representing something in the D&D rules, right? I forget exactly where it is (might be the DMG) but I'm pretty sure it specifies that the appearance of spells does vary by the caster.
    It is called "dweomer". Basically, it is a "magic aura" that accompanies a spell or a magic item. It can be interpreted as being dependent on the type of magic used, or on the particular caster who performed that particular piece of magic; most often it is the latter.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dweomer...agons)#Dweomer

    In OotS, Rich has decided to interpret the dweomer as being dependent on the caster, and it is remarkably consistent. Additionally, check one thing: In the comic, whenever someone performs a spell, and their eyes are open, not uncommonly they take on the colour of that particular caster's dweomer. When Vaarsuvius accepted the deal with the devils, V's eyes became permanently the colour of V's dweomer, possibly indicating how V was suffused with magic up to the gills.

    Some examples of this:

    The warlock in the latest comic, panel 2 (compare the warlock's eyes in panel 1 with his eyes in panel 2).

    Panels 8-12, with Vaarsuvius being angry at Elan and "charging up" V's magic.

    Throughout the whole comic, Tsukiko uses both divine and arcane magic, and her eyes are almost permanently set to the respective dweomers of each type (which are both bluish in hue, only the arcane type is more of a navy blue).

    The most epic example: Durkon, panel 12 (of course, this also works as a shout out to Storm from the X-men, but remember that Durkon's dweomer is white).

    Samantha, the evil sorceress (panels 3 and 8)

    Samantha after kicking Haley's butt (panel 9)

    This doesn't always happen, but it happens often enough. I wonder if the "having your eyes glow with the colour of your dweomer" thing doesn't mean that you are super-charging your magic to do something in a no-holds-barred way.

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    Last edited by JoseB; 2010-06-26 at 03:38 AM.
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  3. - Top - End - #33
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    I think the aesthetics of the magic can vary from person to person as much as they want.

    In my games, shield of faith cast by a cleric will emit glyphs and symbols of the deity involved. (or if PC-controlled, whatever they want) A dragon casting it as an arcane spell will instead have rotating rings of dragonmarks around it.


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  4. - Top - End - #34
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by Pamela View Post
    what im trying say is that if you guys say that the color mahs if the personalit, how Tsukiko who is vil have the same color efect of the Azure paladins, who are good?
    Because her divine energy comes form the same pantheon (most likely provided by Rat)

  5. - Top - End - #35
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by JoseB View Post
    In OotS, Rich has decided to interpret the dweomer as being dependent on the caster, and it is remarkably consistent.
    I'm not sure if it's an exception or not, but when Xykon casts Cloister in #484 the dweomer appears yellow, which was Dorukan's colour, not Xykon's. It's a bit unclear whether that spell is something intrinsic to Dorukan's headband (e.g. it's an epic magic item) or whether the headband is just an aid to casting it, though.

  6. - Top - End - #36
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Another reason I don't really mind: I play Touhou. Everyone's magic takes on different themes. One character shoots multicolored ghostly butterflies, another shoots reddish crystals, and yet another shoots rainbows. Mind you, they have completely different repertoires of spells, but the themes all of their spells take are more tied to their personality and nature than the spell itself.

    The most D&D Wizard-like character they have fires differently-colored auras depending on which element she uses; her barrier is a synthesis of these (a purple pentagram symbolizing the five Oriental Elements).


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  7. - Top - End - #37
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    There could be other influences as well. Could it be that the Crimson Mantle alters the Dweomer of the goblins who wear it?
    Last edited by Darthteej; 2010-06-26 at 04:13 AM.
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  8. - Top - End - #38
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by factotum View Post
    I'm not sure if it's an exception or not, but when Xykon casts Cloister in #484 the dweomer appears yellow, which was Dorukan's colour, not Xykon's. It's a bit unclear whether that spell is something intrinsic to Dorukan's headband (e.g. it's an epic magic item) or whether the headband is just an aid to casting it, though.
    I believe the headband supposed to be an epic magic item of sorts. I remember Dorukan's magic being yellow, though I could be wrong.

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  9. - Top - End - #39
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    I believe you are thinking lightsabers, not spells.
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  10. - Top - End - #40
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    It's fine the way it is. As someone has pointed out, casters leave a signature on their spells, and the color of them represent this. Plus, I like it also from an aesthetic point of view.

  11. - Top - End - #41
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyuubi View Post
    I honestly think you're just nitpicking. I'm sorry if this is important to you but I don't think it's all that important. Granted, there are some colors that are kind of unclear. Tell me, have you read the comic goblins?
    True. It's nice to see a nice black pattern for evil, a white one for good and so forth. But since when the color of evil is black and white is the color of good? Xykon's black is the color of the void.

    It's art: Rich's way to illustrate the personality of each spellcaster.

    Tsukiko's blue because she has some kind of innocence, hey... evil people can be innocent too . How would someone notice love in Xykon? He's pure evil for Tyr's sake !

    In the case of the sapphire guard, the blue comes from nobility, I would imagine.

    Belkar's white was a joke. If he'd cast a spell, I imagine it would be sort of reddish, since he likes blood a lot(By the way, Rich, don't kill him yet ).

    In the "Goblins", everybody has his own color.

    In my opinion, yellow can mean virtue of a paladin or greed, since gold is yellow. It's the art the Giant chose. I'm fine with that really. Don't spoil your own reading of this comic by thinking such things . Forget it and you'll see the light .

    But seriously: So many comics out there that are only pretty pictures. This one has a plot good enough for me to forget they are stick figures
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  12. - Top - End - #42
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    I honestly never expected anyone would make a problem of spell colors, of all things. You learn something new every day.
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  13. - Top - End - #43
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Since it's a comic and relies heavily on visual aids, I like how he's got the colours complementing the casters. V's red robes and a neon green aura (not counting Disintegrate, if he draws it as green) would look sort of like a horrible, horrible Christmas special, after all.
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  14. - Top - End - #44
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by JoseB View Post
    It is called "dweomer". Basically, it is a "magic aura" that accompanies a spell or a magic item. It can be interpreted as being dependent on the type of magic used, or on the particular caster who performed that particular piece of magic; most often it is the latter.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dweomer...agons)#Dweomer

    In OotS, Rich has decided to interpret the dweomer as being dependent on the caster, and it is remarkably consistent. Additionally, check one thing: In the comic, whenever someone performs a spell, and their eyes are open, not uncommonly they take on the colour of that particular caster's dweomer. When Vaarsuvius accepted the deal with the devils, V's eyes became permanently the colour of V's dweomer, possibly indicating how V was suffused with magic up to the gills.

    Some examples of this:

    The warlock in the latest comic, panel 2 (compare the warlock's eyes in panel 1 with his eyes in panel 2).

    Panels 8-12, with Vaarsuvius being angry at Elan and "charging up" V's magic.

    Throughout the whole comic, Tsukiko uses both divine and arcane magic, and her eyes are almost permanently set to the respective dweomers of each type (which are both bluish in hue, only the arcane type is more of a navy blue).

    The most epic example: Durkon, panel 12 (of course, this also works as a shout out to Storm from the X-men, but remember that Durkon's dweomer is white).

    Samantha, the evil sorceress (panels 3 and 8)

    Samantha after kicking Haley's butt (panel 9)

    This doesn't always happen, but it happens often enough. I wonder if the "having your eyes glow with the colour of your dweomer" thing doesn't mean that you are super-charging your magic to do something in a no-holds-barred way.

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  15. - Top - End - #45
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    "Colour" does not have to equal "alignment".

    Apprently, Rich chose it to be this way in his world. Legit. Understandable. Could have been othervise, was not, there are no objective reasons for or against. Choice of style. Personal preference matter. I like it. Next.

    Unavoidable Star Wars Example: A red lightsabre does not have to indicate the wielder is an evil sith. Can. Might. But does not have to.

  16. - Top - End - #46
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Well, it seems that you guys DO have a point...

    the problem seems to be me...

    yes, i can live if this fact, and the comic is aredy made, we can't change, and who is me to know something about another person work, i can't even make a good history or draw a stick man...

    but he could at least separate in dark or light tons, because, he do make a distinction between, arcane and divine, as we can see in Tsukiko Magic, a dark blue for arcana, and a light blue for divine.

    but it just on her, he never do it again, so we can see the wizard guy have the same color of the paladins and clerics, and this:

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0166.html - Arcane

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0453.html - Divine

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0465.html Divine

    Quote Originally Posted by onthetown View Post
    Since it's a comic and relies heavily on visual aids, I like how he's got the colours complementing the casters. V's red robes and a neon green aura (not counting Disintegrate, if he draws it as green) would look sort of like a horrible, horrible Christmas special, after all.
    if im a Mystic Theurge, and have these guys personalitis, i gona have 2 purple
    energys, what in my opinion is worst them have a Red clothes and green energy http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__...dElvesSots.jpg

    or blue clothes and White energy http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0428.html

    Last edited by Pamela; 2010-06-26 at 10:45 AM.

  17. - Top - End - #47
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by Ancalagon View Post
    Unavoidable Star Wars Example: A red lightsabre does not have to indicate the wielder is an evil sith. Can. Might. But does not have to.
    Yup. Luke gives Leia a red lightsaber at the start of the Corellia trilogy to demonstrate he thinks she's a Jedi- even if she hasn't really "completed formal training"

    She challenges him to spar- and (since he underestimates her) then proceeds to beat him. And explains that she's been practicing.

    Definitely one of Leia's better moments.
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  18. - Top - End - #48
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by Pamela View Post
    but he could at least separate in dark or light tons, because, he do make a distinction between, arcane and divine, as we can see in Tsukiko Magic, a dark blue for arcana, and a light blue for divine.

    but it just on her, he never do it again, so we can see the wizard guy have the same color of the paladins and clerics, and this:

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0166.html - Arcane

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0453.html - Divine

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0465.html Divine
    Tsukiko is the only person in the comic to use both divine and arcane spells. In case of all other spellcasters, we know whether they're arcane or divine, except maybe in the case of nameless hobgoblin casters. So no distinction is necessary unless more Mystic Theurges appear.
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  19. - Top - End - #49
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by JoseB View Post
    It is called "dweomer". Basically, it is a "magic aura" that accompanies a spell or a magic item. It can be interpreted as being dependent on the type of magic used, or on the particular caster who performed that particular piece of magic; most often it is the latter.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dweomer...agons)#Dweomer
    Thanks so much for that link... not only you win the thread, but thanks to you, I finally know where the word "dweomer" comes from. It's been bugging me since the time I first played 1st edition... er... many, many years ago.

    @ Pamela: I think the other comments managed to convince you that the magic colors are not a bug, but a feature in OotS. This leaves the author's color choices to a mere question of personal taste. And there are not that many colors to choose from, you know.

  20. - Top - End - #50
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    Yup. Luke gives Leia a red lightsaber at the start of the Corellia trilogy to demonstrate he thinks she's a Jedi- even if she hasn't really "completed formal training"

    She challenges him to spar- and (since he underestimates her) then proceeds to beat him. And explains that she's been practicing.

    Definitely one of Leia's better moments.
    wow someone who is more Star wars geek them me! O_O

    well if you guys want use Star wars as examples, lests go, we all see in the Space battles we have a distint colors for the empire laser and the rebel laser, the color dont show if you are evil or good since the colors change in the old to the news movies, but it works to make easyer to undertend the space battle...

    Diferent colors for the atacks are important for you dont get lost

    in the magic works for you to know wich type of magic, the guy is using, i think Stan Lee point this in one interview, that his team uses the same color for psychic and sinetic powers, them two mutants if this powers fight, it get very ugly...

  21. - Top - End - #51
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    Thumbs up Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by Gwynfrid View Post
    Thanks so much for that link... not only you win the thread, but thanks to you, I finally know where the word "dweomer" comes from. It's been bugging me since the time I first played 1st edition... er... many, many years ago.

    @ Pamela: I think the other comments managed to convince you that the magic colors are not a bug, but a feature in OotS. This leaves the author's color choices to a mere question of personal taste. And there are not that many colors to choose from, you know.
    Good that this "tread" was useful for someone...

    yes, indid, this color system is part of this universe, we cant change it...

    maybe we should think about what personality makes determinad color...

    thee thee...
    Last edited by Pamela; 2010-06-26 at 12:02 PM.

  22. - Top - End - #52
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan View Post
    Belkar's white was a joke. If he'd cast a spell, I imagine it would be sort of reddish, since he likes blood a lot(By the way, Rich, don't kill him yet ).
    Belkar was casting from a scroll he found searching Durkon. White is Durkon's casting colour.
    Secondly, Belkar wasn't his normal self at the time - the "Owl's Wisdom" spell seemed to have temporarily given him a Celia-like value-system, as well as making him smarter.

    Its an interesting question in itself - is Belkar evil only because he's stupid? Is it all just rage against a world he lacks the wisdom to understand?

    Conversely, if Elan weren't brain-damaged, would the think like Nale? Did his bullying twin brother accidentally impair the "be an evil bastard" part of Elan's brain?

  23. - Top - End - #53
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    its magic, a wizard did it (ok ok, sometimes a cleric, bard, sorcerer or warlock too)

    as far as i understand magic in toots (and DnD in general) the caster chooses the colour of their magic themselves, either by choice or by personality. rich in particular chooses to have his chars have colourd magic based on the person casting it, not on WHAT they cast. its a good way to give readers hints, and it also makes magic somewhat more personal. its a small detail that makes this comic just a little more tought out then most

  25. - Top - End - #55
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Every spellcaster has their own color; it is not based on their alignment or type of magic or anything. It is mostly a matter of choice or personality, though most clerics tend to clump into the same general color if they worship the same gods because they tend to choose the same colors and/or have similar personalities.

    Elan has a similar color to the Azurite priests because it's not as if everyone in the North sits around going, "Gosh, we can't pick blue, because those people on another continent all picked blue!" Tsukiko uses the same color for her divine magic as the Azurite priests because they both worship the Twelve Gods, who are worshipped as a pantheon by all alignments in Azure City.

    And as far as the girl in #730, I promise that whether she is using mind energy or fire does not affect the story in the slightest, and therefore it doesn't matter whether or not you can tell what it is.
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  26. - Top - End - #56
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Pamela, I think your peeve with the colors is that you're expecting an universal standard, but there isn't any. Each person has his own aura, like fingerprints. The only consistency is that each person has always the same color for the same type of magical effect. V's arcane magic will always be pink, Durkon's divine magic will always be white...


    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    And as far as the girl in #730, I promise that whether she is using mind energy or fire does not affect the story in the slightest, and therefore it doesn't matter whether or not you can tell what it is.
    ;_; so she'll forever remain nameless?
    Last edited by Snake-Aes; 2010-06-28 at 07:52 AM.

  27. - Top - End - #57
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    It IS Nameless! :O
    Last edited by Serpentine; 2010-06-28 at 07:58 AM.

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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by Serpentine View Post
    It IS Nameless! :O
    <drops on the knees, tears flowing>
    I...I can live with that.
    <collapses>

  29. - Top - End - #59
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    And as far as the girl in #730, I promise that whether she is using mind energy or fire does not affect the story in the slightest, and therefore it doesn't matter whether or not you can tell what it is.
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    Default Re: I love Order of the stick but it have a problem, The Magic Energy

    Soulknives have had red blades in WotC art before - the Atavist's blades (Races of Eberron) are red.

    And I am a big fan of personality-based dweomers.

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