After becoming inured to the prospect of continued prevarication in the selling of Aston Villa and therefore the chance of reverting the downward spiral, up pops something that – at first glance – seems to be everything that any good Villa fan has been praying for.

Great play seems to be put upon the scale of the new owner’s wealth and the fact that he seems to be a ‘self-made’ man. He seems to have gained considerable experience and ability in his management of his business as well, and it is out of that management expertise we hope to see what kind of first steps he will take at Villa Park in terms of his appointment of CEO and also of the team manager. Names for both positions have already been touted, but we wait to see them come to fruition.

But I suggest that this is not really a “Dr. Xia Project” but a “China Project” in disguise. The Express and Star report Steve Hollis as saying:

“I’d look at what’s going on in China – it is no secret President Xi [Dr. Xia’s cousin] wants to win the World Cup by 2050. They are implementing strategies – 100 million six and seven year olds in China part of their curriculum is kicking a ball every day. Tony Xia wants Aston Villa to be the best supported club in China.”

But there is no doubt that this event has halted the severe depression that has been intensely building up over the last five years, and the incredibly sad demise of what – even ten years ago; nay, even five years ago – was regarded as a major club in the UK. We, the fans, perhaps still think that Aston Villa is a major club, but the club has not won a trophy in twenty years, and the three cup finals we have played in since have got progressively worse in terms of the players’ ability and commitment to succeed, let alone the poor management appointments, decisions and performance. Not only results but also the sheer attitude of the players have latterly been under severe scrutiny and the situation invites a complete overhaul by a determined and competent owner, CEO and manager.

It would perhaps be churlish to criticise something almost before it’s happened, but I have to say that I am a little worried. I remember all too well the events of 10 years ago when 24 years of the reign of Doug Ellis had got too much for many supporters who welcomed Randy Lerner as the new saviour, and rubbished the previous chairman in one breath. Ten years on, the policies of Randy Lerner proved to often replicate those of his chairman predecessor, and so the resulting demise of the club created a backlash for this chairman as well. So, have supporters learnt from the last 10 years? Do they now put total faith in Dr. Xia to produce a miracle cure?

We wait, with a deep breath, to see what transpires and what medicine is applied. But please, Dr. Xia, do not make us hold our breaths for too long!

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John Lerwill
I'm a Villan of more than 60 years standing and an occasional writer on Villa history. For me there is only one football club worth supporting, but I am now wondering whether I will again see anything like the pageant that was paraded under Ron Saunders or even that by Big Ron and Brian Little. My glass, however, is always half-full! Click here for my Villa website.

Comments 236

  1. Trinity

    Hello John.
    You’re right that we need to see things in perspective and not have complete faith in someone we don’t know. And carrying on in the same vein as previous posts in the last 24 hours, there is only one we should have complete faith in, the Almighty GOD, but sadly he retired from playing ages ago and returned to his native Ireland:)
    Seriously, you are correct to be a bit worried. I was two weeks back. That said, I think it will be okay. If it isn’t we’ve got plenty of experience to fall back on in that department. That said, I agree that Villa is a China project. That could be why it must work, and lucky Dr. Xia has the responsibility to make it so. I don’t think he’s naive. He knows what he’s up against. He says he already feels the pressure. Good. If he’s a rock, pressure can make him a diamond.

  2. DarrenO

    From my perspective, Ellis albeit self made was overly parochial in his approach to running the club to the detriment of expansion, ‘foreign influence’ and progression.

    There were periods of opportunity when regularly qualifying for Europe that most teams today would milk dry for increased revenue, it felt like a jolly for us fans and Ellis .

    Ellis saw something in Lerner that suggested him, he’d found an extension of himself, it’s like my own son isn’t good enough, I’ve found the perfect in son-in-law to hand the baton on to.
    Hindsight and and a re-addressing of criteria for ownership on Ellis’ part would surely lead to the same conclusion that Lerner although much more wealthy than Ellis survived on an income generated by a trust fund and didn’t actually have the wear with all to sustain ownership.

    No doubt Lerner is a nice man and his heart was once in the right place, if we look at his early actions but so much of that will be lost by the last 6 years.

    Hollis to his credit has sourced business men given the new owner and the likes of Ellison being touted as a potential owner. This is exactly the type of people we need in charge of a football club because they built businesses and wealth themselves.

    Xia certainly didn’t accomplish it on his own and therefore (hopefully) has the nouse to employ the right key people in the right key roles and evidence although not concrete would suggest this is the case with Wyness and Comolli waiting in the wings to join.

    There will always be an element of the king is dead, long live the king but as fans we should absolutely be healthily sceptical and not swept along with a tide of good feeling. To this end, I’m quite sure the fans that lead this years protests won’t quickly forget and ensure and re-occuring of events of the last ten years will be picked up on and addressed more quickly.

    AVFC have a part to play in bringing in the supporters groups and getting them on board with the plan as much as it can be announced.

    My glass is half full, Lerner is gone, inward investment into the playing staff, a very ambitious owner and a chance to return Villa to the top table but also be consistently challenging as opposed to periodic flashes of brilliance over the last 40 years.

    I’m also pro any stadium name changes as a source of income, happened to our intl ground Lansdowne Road and it will always be that but in any news report or print it’s called the Aviva, made no difference to us fans and neither will Lotus Villa Park. Just as long as Witton Lane stand or the Recon Witton Lane replaces the Doug Ellis

    Proud History, New Future

  3. Clive Evans

    Darren – I’ve seen a report that suggests we are to have a new stadium name of Lotus Villa Park to reflect our owner’s Lotus Health products; so long as we do not have to be called the dragons or change our team colours I can take that. As Jenny says (on Twitter) we don’t want red shirts like Cardiff.

    Going off at a tangent I find the banner headline on the AVL Twitter page in bad taste – it uses the Royal British Legion commemoration, or am I reading something wrong here? I, like probably a few here, have served in the armed forces and prefer these words to be associated with Remembrance in the strictest terms.

  4. John Lerwill

    Clive: “As Jenny says (on Twitter) we don’t want red shirts like Cardiff.”

    Yes, but I’d hope that claret is close enough to the Chinese preferred red. He might lighten the tone of claret, though.

  5. steamer

    So much negativity on the blogs you’d think Ghengis Khan had taken over, give the bloke a chance. Steve Hollis speaks highly of him and now that his job is done he has no need to praise him.
    He’s genuine enough to move his family to Birmingham and will win over the support of the Chinese population of the city. I would imagine that Villa shirts etc will sell like hot rice cakes in Asia now.

  6. DarrenO

    Don’t really read the other blogs and apart from FB kids trying to figure out if Xia as 2 quid or 27b, i’ve not seen much negativity on it (FB).

    Potential to be the richest (financially) club in the world and people are complaining, wasters!!!

  7. runtings

    I too am baffled by so much negative comments – it seems to me like a deal beyond our wildest dreams with an owner that seems to have more ambition for the club than a lot of the fans do right now
    there is nothing i have read or heard re our owner that suggests we should be anything but excited right now

  8. runtings

    i also believe the Chinese government are our real owner via one of there finest young protege’s will gives me even more confidence of major success in the not to distant future

  9. James Gill

    We are in what I can say is the last chance saloon for us older villa fans, a chance to build a club again apart from couple years under Mon and further back to big Ron’s team and Little’s that followed have been fewer than hens teeth
    Our manager appointment is critical,as are our first signings,getting promoted is only target now , don’t care what stadium is called,
    It might be a great to look forward to new season,happy weekends , villa actually winning games ,might even be fit to get a dog for children scared I would kicked last few years
    It’s great to villa be on sports pages with good news,now let the cull begin

  12. Frem

    What’s going on guys ?

    I can see how the club made a mistake on number of companies. He will soon own 5 in China, plus us, so money can’t be to bad ?

    But, Hollis saying about the stadium and turns out its BS? That’s worrying

    Is he also lying about the 60 cities and government involvement ?

    How are we being funded ? Govement by what Hollis says, and what other people say about Recon just being. Holding company that hold shares but can be used to get money out of China. So are the Chinese gov using that to fund us?

  13. runtings

    Frem i don’t know if any of us will be given all the answerers re funding or who actually own us but what seems certain is these guys mean business

  14. John Lerwill

    Frem,

    You are illustrating very well the kind of concerns I have of Chinese involvement.

    While people may say that to have the backing of the Chinese government is a wonderful thing, it could be that one day AVFC may simply be a feeder club to Chinese football. *After* winning a few trophies to soften us all up, of course!

    There are those who feel that leaving the EU will give us more power over our own future. Similarly Villa supporters may well feel at some time in the future (10 or 20 years) that we want to become independent again.

    Only people from the east know the Chinese method.

  15. John Lerwill

    Of course, as China has already become deeply involved in the UK (HS2 and MG as starters), their level of financial holdings may one day cause us as a nation to think of ourselves as a Chinese satellite anyway.

    So, for next Chinese New Year, learn how to say “Cong Xi Fa Cai ” in view of the future close harmony that will be needed.

  18. villa@herts

    I have to say that when I couldn’t find ANYTHING about Xia on the internet and very little about Recon I was concerned but I thought “well the club must of seen evidence of all these claims, wouldn’t they!” Well it is begining to look like every claim the club has made statements about is simply repeating what they have been told!

    IMO there can be only four explanations! 1) there has been a simple lack of attention to detail by Hollis & his team & something has been lost in translation! 2) This has all been some sort of hoax & it will turn out that Xia is a Chinese Ali G! 3) This is an attempted scam by Chinese gangsters or 4) Xia is a front for the Chinese government but if this is the case surely they would have done a better job, by creating a cover internet profile for Xia which would have made him much more creditable, or am I giving them too much respect!!

    Which ever of the above is correct I think it is unlikely this deal will get through the Premiership/football league scrutiny! Or am I giving them too much credit? I have this terrible but feeling that there will much merriment in Small Heath!!

  19. John Lerwill

    villa@herts,

    And the fact that Recon have shown quite a heavy loss in their last return is disturbing, but *all* explained if Recon is essentially a conduit by which the Chinese Government is trying to infiltrate.

    I think this is the only likely situation taking into account that it’s been stated that Dr. Xia is a cousin of their President.

    As for PL/FL scrutiny? I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s all glossed over to appease the Chinese.

  20. John Lerwill

    I’m sure David Camron’s link with Villa has been brought to the attention of the Chinese President during the delegation visit to China a year or two back and hence why we are where we are.

    ‘Dave’ will (I’m sure) provide a smooth passage for their acquisition.

  21. villa@herts

    You may be right John but ownership born on deceit and lies doesn’t bode well!

    Let’s hope the Chinese don’t know about William being a supporter given his gran’s “the chinese are rude” remarks!

    Just to add to your list of Chinese business interests in the UK they are going to build the next generation of nuclear power stations! Which it could be argued is a much bigger risk than owning a second teir football club!

  22. steamer

    Chinese just taken over 4 of the 9 Mercedes dealerships in Birmingham.
    I think that the Villa link with the Royal family will be a shield against any problems with the Chinese government due to the enormous respect they have for the UK and its establishment. They’ll also like Camoron because he’s a bigger liar than any of them.

  24. steamer

    How about Louis van Gaal as next boss ? best manager in the country by a mile, 7 league titles, 2 Cups, 1 UEFA Cup, 1 Champs Lge + 1 RU.

  25. John Lerwill

    villa@herts,

    Totally agreed.

    The Chinese acquisition by the Chinese is of course a secondary issue in economic and risk terms in the UK though, but a potentially massive help to China to achieve dominance in football.

    I’m sure ‘Dave’ has used the Villa matter to oil our (UK) access into China.

    And I agree with Steamer that the Prince William link helps the oiling process.

    How do you spell ‘Dave’s name Steamer? Chameleon is it? 😉

  27. Mark King

    JL- Bendy cameron 😉

    I don’t think the Chinese have forgiven us for stealing those tea seeds, Long gone are the days of trading heroin for tea but in reality its all the same.

    Steamer- 🙂 🙂

  28. proxopera

    “may one day cause us as a nation to think of ourselves as a Chinese satellite anyway.”
    “Only people from the east know the Chinese method.”
    “Recon is essentially a conduit by which the Chinese Government is trying to infiltrate.”
    “Yes, but I’d hope that claret is close enough to the Chinese preferred red.”

    Sinophobic much John ?

  29. John Lerwill

    Prox,

    Sinophobic?

    Well, let’s just say they are a different culture. In the west we have our variances, but they are not as profound as with regard to eastern countries. I have no problems with Chinese per se, but their different approach is a cause for us to look more deeply into what’s happening with regard to Villa and any other business interest they’re involved with.

    In other words, to assume they think like us is a mistake.

  30. proxopera

    John ,
    An American billionaire sold Aston Villa football club to a Chinese billionaire for a knockdown price in the absence of any western billionaires . We dont own AVFC , either Villa fans or the people of Birmingham. To suggest that its a convoluted plot by the devious Chinese for the world domination of ….football… is highly fanciful. It might turn out to be the case , but I seriously doubt it.

    All we know is that a billionaire , who happens to be Chinese , bought our beloved club, and has stated his plans to turn around its fortunes , partly through the marketing of Aston Villa to the Chinese public. We can’t actually do anything about the sale , so why dont we give the bloke a chance until we have some actual reason to suspect him and lets not make a Johnny England movie plot out of it.

  32. villa@herts

    “All we know is that a billionaire , who happens to be Chinese , bought our beloved club” But there is no evidence that he is a billionaire Proxopera! All we know is that owns Recon which owned one company Lotus, which last year lost millions! This is nothing to do with being anti Chinese but questioning where he is getting his money from and is he the right person to own the club we suppourt!

    Personally, wether he is an American or Chinese billonaire makes not a jot of difference, they all got their money from robbing those who have little or nothing!

    My only interest is that some of their money will improve the club!

  33. Jenny Truman

    Hello again everyone .
    Haven’t posted for a while as I stopped watching AV as there was nothing positive or entertaining about them and i am not into masochism.

    Excellent article Mr L and I agree : reasons to be v cautious .

    1. The material misstatements on how many companies are controlled is quite honestly ludicrous . These are not things you should be getting wrong and Hollis has had to retract these inflations. Why weren’t these representations verified. The financial times have got the info why didn’t he .

    2. Also reported is the exaggerations on rebuilding China as if he was some sort of Chinese Christoher Wren . He isn’t . Neither is he a billionaire .

    3. Why is he discussing renaming villa park when he’s not even passed the fit proper test let alone bought the club . Premature ? I think it is crass .

    4. He’s living in cloud cuckoo land if he thinks villa fans are going to be eating lotus health food at lotus villa park . (Yes , he has said he wants to sell his lotus products at the football ) Unless they can be incorporated into a pint of lager or a balti pie this takes delusional to a new level .

    5. Stated ambitions of finishing top three in five years – see above

    6. What the hell is Dr Tomy a Dr of ? He studied landscape design . Beware of ppl calling themselves Drs unless they are Drs of medicine . It’s as funny as labelling that dreadful poo obsessed woman Gillian Mcreath a Doctor.

    7. The Chinese have aspirations in football and if the Chinese gov were backing him why aren’t they admitting to it . They are conspicuously quiet .

    Apart from that – he’s ideal . But my gut instinct is he’s a chancer . Hope I’m wrong but too many “miscommunications’ and affectations for me.

    Also / why did Berstein and King run for the hills. ? Was it anything to do with this ? Maybe coincidence but I’m damn sure it wasn’t over a leaked e mail.

    On happier note
    Have front row tickets to see Lionel Ritchie at Gloucester rugby stadium / end of June and I can’t bloody wait .

    And just booked to go to Mexuco in August . Salsa and Zumba lessons start next week in preparation !

  34. proxopera

    Ok , point taken . We dont know he is a billionaire and we dont know where his money comes from but he did’nt stop a slew of other benevolent would-be owners from buying Aston Villa because there was’nt much interest as evidenced by the low sale price.
    I would sacrifice the glory of a top six status for a club that has some honour & pride in itself and give its fans something to enjoy on a regular basis but that decision is not in our hands.

  35. Frem

    It’s worrying but nothing with Villa is smooth. He’s not even our owner yet, I thought he would have gone through the fit and proper test before they announced it.

    Hollis and AVFC have said a number of things that have turned out to be wrong by the sounds of it. Is Hollis lying or has he be lied to ?

    It’s annoying that knowone knows how wealthy Xia is or where the money is coming from. Maybe that’s what’s scaring people. I’ve seen so many different figures

  36. Frem

    On the positives – He talks a good game. Developing the youth, bringing in methods to prevent as many injures, top 6 then top 3.

    Maybe he really wants to that, and maybe he has the potential to do it

  37. Jenny Truman

    If you read the Financial Times article Frem – sorry I can’t remember where I read it , it demonstrates he has exaggerated his wealth and influence . God knows how or why Hollis was duped , misled , went along with this false info and the reason given for the error , ‘miscommunication’ is well , no reason but an excuse .

    Look at his outlandish objective – to be top 3 in five years – premier league . Are they having a laugh !

    Prox – I’d rather we didn’t sell our soul too. There’s too much talk of this Lotus health food ( where does the monosodium glutamate come in ? ) Lotus Villa Park when he hasn’t even passed the fit and proper test . This couid be the tip of a very sharp iceberg .

  39. Trinity

    That said, having worked in north Asia for many years, I know there is a lot of potential for miscommunication. It’s the language/cultural barrier. I think Xia will pass the probe.

  41. John Lerwill

    Prox: “To suggest that its a convoluted plot by the devious Chinese for the world domination of ….football… is highly fanciful. “

    Good morning … sorry to respond so late but we had visitors last night.

    Mmmmm … I would say your comment is even more fanciful! 😉

    I am *not* in the business of conspiracy theories and try to work on the basis of evidence that I have. To me the situation I described sticks out on your face. But we’ll see, won’t we?

    The facts is that China is up to a lot in this world by one device or another. That’s not to say that the USA hasn’t also (or even Britain) … but I’m speaking purely in the context of what’s going on at VP.

  42. John Lerwill

    Prox: “he did’nt stop a slew of other benevolent would-be owners from buying Aston Villa because there was’nt much interest as evidenced by the low sale price.”

    That’s funny, Hollis said there was a short list of 6 (six!) prospective buyers, and by process of elimination they whittled it down to Dr. Xia.

  43. John Lerwill

    Jenny: “The Chinese have aspirations in football and if the Chinese gov were backing him why aren’t they admitting to it . They are conspicuously quiet .”

    Not quite, Jenny. There’s a video on Vital Villa that includes a statement from the Chinese foreign minister giving their blessing to Dr. Xia’s move.

  44. John Lerwill

    Jenny: “Prox – I’d rather we didn’t sell our soul too. There’s too much talk of this Lotus health food ( where does the monosodium glutamate come in ? ) Lotus Villa Park when he hasn’t even passed the fit and proper test . This couid be the tip of a very sharp iceberg “

    Atta girl! 🙂 Spot on.

  45. John Lerwill

    Trinity: “I think Xia will pass the probe.”

    Only with Dave’s help, I’m sure.

    You’re right about mistranslation problems, but we also know full well there is a cultural divide. A country that’s happy to see animals slaughtered to satisfy questionable tastes and also has great delight in eating dogs is rather different to ours, don’t you agree?

    Mind you, China is not alone in that department.

  46. John Lerwill

    Prox: “To assume that billionaires think like us ,is an even bigger mistake.”

    You think I do? I happen to have a connection with the Sultan of Brunei, so I don’t think in the world of Noddy-land.

  47. Jenny Truman

    Well we do know that genius’s can have shortcomings in other areas but calling yourself a professor when you are actually a teaching assistant doesn’t fill me with confidence about believing his other ‘miscommunications’
    Hopefully he’s grown out of this phase but there’s too many warning signs so an intensive investigation is paramount . We know that clubs like Small Heath and Leeds have fallen prey to egotistical charlatans please do t let it happen to us

    http://www.scmp.com/sport/soccer/article/1949264/xia-jiantong-man-save-aston-villa-or-will-fans-be-wishing-randy-lerner

  48. Jenny Truman

    John I didn’t know about the video (is it genuine :-)) but the Chinese gov do I understand hold a 15 percent investment in Man City which they have been more vocal about (so I have read)
    Wouldn’t the Chinese have gone for a premier league club as they did with man city.

    Looks to me like RL was so desperate to sell he sold at under value ( if it only increases to 100 mill on promotion). This is worrying as it attracts the wrong sort of buyer : those who can’t afford it’s true value and the continued investment .

  50. Mark King

    Its all looking rather dodgy at the moment folks but as was said on here yesterday what influence has Prince William had after his recent chat with the Chinese president. Add to that Cameron during their visit and the fact he chose us over 7 other prem teams may not be so surprising.

    China want to dominate football and win the world cup , well so do every other country. Thing is if you are really going to go for it wouldn’t owning the Club that pretty much started it all be a huge coup? and at a price so low? they do like a good haggle in the east. Wonder if lerner got a tax concession?

    Saw a post and the figures on the hong kong stock exchange site stating the Recon group had been registered there 29 days ago at the time? it looks like the purchases of the other 4 companies is going through just like the villa purchase they are still in the process. His lotus firm turnover billions yet lost £70 odd million? either a downturn in the use of MSG worldwide or cash withdrawn to purchase companies and villa? I know for a fact Poland have now banned MSG and the Chinese are now beginning to phase it out no surprise it makes things taste good but makes you eat more and hungry after an hour ( I’m sure we have all had the chinese food effect 😉 )

    I think there is definite political moves behind this as he is so close to the president, apparently the presidents cousin was put onto one of his firms boards and just as quickly withdrawn? who knows

    JL- maybe more contact with the west will change some of the Chinese habits we find abhorrent on the other hand we might just begin to use the massive food source that is Insects as I’m sure our ancestors did. After all eating Cows in India is a big no no where as dogs are a rabies risk, I witnessed many a rock throne at dogs in India, who are we to say? I agree there killing of wild animals is the major concern for very dodgy medical practises which is a shame as their system could teach the west a lot.

    No coincidence either the so called black web is associated with criminals and sex pests an is vilified when it is the only means of communication people have with the world in some of these regimes.

  51. Jenny Truman

    I see that Mark and clearly the prospect of a Chinese gov connection could be a good thing but Chinese gov already invest in Man City – a premier league club not a lame horse like us . Why deceive on how many companies they control . Why call yourself a Dr and Professor when you’re not . When is he just about to find the holy grail ? 🙂

    I for one don’t want Villa Park to become Lotus Health Food Park (how long will it take them to drop the Villa) and to be talking about such a sensitive issue to the press when he hasn’t even got past the post . It’s both crass and stupid . The idea that Lotus Park is going to sell health food products just shouts delusional to me . Has he ever talked to an Aston Villa fan . this life long villa fan has admitted he tried to buy six other clubs – life long fans of those too ? Too many red flags IMO

  52. Mark King

    Jen- why call yourself Tony 😉 He does seem a tad excitable

    On the Villa fan Its unprovable but as a business man he’s not going to just look at Villa, Hollis is a man city fan doesn’t mean he can’t work for Villa. A pinch of salt is required. villas at the price stated is a steal thats for sure.

  53. Jenny Truman

    If he’s not a life long fan then cut the crap we don’t want to hear it , it’s such a worn out cliche id rather he said he was a Dortmund fan.
    Can’t wait to sample the Doctor Tony healthy lemongrass beer and Professir Tony lotus blossom hot dog at lotus health food stadium . 🙂 🙂 this is his vision !

  54. Mark King

    Jen- I agree he seems to have been massively honest on his plans from the off, maybe in a watch this hand not this one way 😉 I hope not its the last thing Villa deserves after the Leaner years and I do mean Leaner not Lerner 🙂

  55. John Lerwill

    Mark: “maybe more contact with the west will change some of the Chinese habits “

    There is that possibility, but since they’re more in the mood of dominating (in a subtle way, except when it’s not) I wouldn’t hold out too many hopes of quick changes.

    Yes, about India etc I did say that China was not alone. And that includes Japan, Norway and quite a few other countries.

  56. John Lerwill

    Jenny – on the video. A video can only show what it shows of course – and that was the foreign minister speaking.

    Although they’ve got a publicly declared share in Man City that doesn’t preclude them from taking another tactic … maybe they don’t want to alarm Man City by also publicly putting money elsewhere, and also as Dr. Xia (the president’s cousin) fits the cover bill. They couldn’t/wouldn’t take over Man City but they can take over Villa – indirectly.

  57. Mark King

    JL- I’m not enamoured of our own factory farming methods either, I do believe though as the penny drops other methods will be forced to be adopted,. And as the wests tastes change the Chinese if they want to sell into our market will have to change to suit. The problem is the Money men at the top as usual, lets hope they are replaced by more ethical people on both sides, The public have to wake up as you’ve said, we are the driver.

  59. RichardS

    This deal stinks – we know nothing about Dr. Xia. How much is he worth. Nobody has ever heard of him.

    Hollis has been conned and he and Lerner are fools. Those pair of idiots couldn’t even order a Chinese Takeaway.

    The situation is ridiculous. More humiliation for our club

  61. John Lerwill

    Mark: “I’m not enamoured of our own factory farming methods either, I do believe though as the penny drops other methods will be forced to be adopted,”

    That’s a fair point, but I was thinking more in terms of deep-lying cultural behaviours. And views as a result of history – e.g. the Opium Wars.

    But as China has the upper hand in the world’s market, it’s mentality will be to manoeuvre others in the way they want, is it not? Until, as you suggest, circumstances force them to change tack.

  62. Mark King

    Jl- yes they will do what the west has always done I suppose but exposure to different ideas will change them as it will us for good or bad. We are at a disadvantage in that we tend to be less community minded these days and our own identity is more individual

  65. Trinity

    The culture is changing in China regarding animal welfare. I know that in Korea where dogs are slaughtered for human consumption, most Koreans don’t or won’t eat dogs. Many find the idea of eating dogs disgusting, especially when they are beaten (hanging upside down) to death. There’s this belief in traditional medicine that beating a dog to death then eating its flesh improves sexual stamina. Most Koreans know that is bollocks, and no longer eat dogs. They prefer them as pets. I think modern China, though still behind, is the same, at least in urban areas. Let’s not stereotype people based on nationality.

    http://www.care2.com/causes/animal-welfare-movement-is-growing-fast-in-china.html

  67. Paul Pears

    I see on the official site, he is no longer DR Tony, but just Tony now, but maybe THAT IS FELT TO BE MORE DOWN TO EARTH.

    The full deal has not really been mentioned much anywhere, which gives Randy a further £40 million in four years time, if Villa regain Premiership status at the first attempt, and then remain there for a further 3years.

    This was agreed in order to give Recon a £50 million war chest to get rid of some players, and buy new ones.

  68. Jenny Truman

    Trin – yes if he has a PHD but from what I have read he doesn’t. When he was a teaching assistant at Harvard, he called himself a professor and fell foul of the authorities for doing so .

    All this holding co business that the vital villa article referred to didn’t really add up to reassuring anyone . He has a holding company big deal . Holding companies don’t trade they are a unifying administrative vehicle . The thing the FL and PL were concerned about was this holding company only administered to one company under his control not five as stated on OS and thus co lost 53 mill last year .
    I think it’s right to ask questions particularly when there have been quite a few errors so far.

  69. Jenny Truman

    Well it was landscape design he did his degree in and I don’t know about anyone else but this article doesn’t inspire confidence . There’s no government backing according to Xia and talk of theme parks should have McGregor turning in his grave . The recruitment of young Chinese players fir the academy will be interesting too .

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3602825/Saviour-dreamer-Sportsmail-talks-Aston-Villa-s-owner-waiting-Dr-Tony-Xia.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

  70. Frem

    A museum is a great idea. We have the history for one

    hes just sold one company for 430 million, and bought a company in the USA for 3.5 billion dollars

    I think we are ok

  72. Trinity

    Jenny
    I agree he shouldn’t call himself a doctor unless qualified to do so. He should have called himself a tutor at Harvard if he was a teaching assistant.
    The truth will become clearer soon.

  74. John Lerwill

    Frem/Trinity,

    What Jenny is saying makes a lot of sense to me.

    I think we’re confusing our need to get Villa back on track with the issue of integrity here. At the end of it all, “Dr. Xia” as an individual might pass the business integrity tests, but I come back to the matter of whether this is a “China Project” in reality *and* how that might influence the development and running of the club.

    And let’s vote for Jenny to replace Doug as President! 🙂

  75. John Lerwill

    Trinity: “They prefer them as pets. I think modern China, though still behind, is the same, at least in urban areas. Let’s not stereotype people based on nationality.”

    Sorry, Trin, I think you miss the point being made. It wasn’t simply about dogs. 😉

    Despite a *slow* change in China on that matter, the ivory trade is still as rampant as ever.

    And the *main* point was that China – culturally – is still vastly different to our culture. Not saying we don’t have faults either.

    I happen to have a daughter-in-law whose father is Chinese and a Chinese doctor is one of my wife’s best friends – and my wife was brought up amongst Chinese. But though we have affection for them and admire many traits, we are aware, still, of differences that are exacerbated within China itself.

    My wife is from Malaysia and I must admit that I know Malaysia a lot better than I do China, but simply by looking at how Malaysia is run it has all the trademarks of western culture in the kind of economy it now has, but the changing of the economy hasn’t made the people “western”. They still retain very much their own ways and outlook. And half the country is made up of Chinese.

  76. John Lerwill

    And, btw, though corruption *is* clearly present everywhere, many eastern countries have corruption as a lifestyle, particularly in business/politics, but at all levels.

  77. Trinity

    John

    It obviously isn’t just about dogs. I posted this post May 12th in concern over a take over bid by Rui Kang.
    John
    “I’d just hope thy’re not one of the Chinese companies that extracts gall bladder juice from bears via a catheter or makes tiger wine.” I haven’t missed the point. I was probably the first to raise it.
    As for corruption, the same might be said about Russia and some Arab states. That doesn’t make any given individual from those states necessarily corrupt, though some undoubtedly are. And they are PL club ownwes. I think we should give Xia a chance. Though I am worried about all that MSG.
    BTW, I lived in north east Asia for 12 years.

  78. John Lerwill

    Trinity,

    I did say that corruption exists everywhere, but is more profound in certain places, the Far East coujntries included.

    The system employed in those countries so permeates the system it is dubious that anyone is not tainted. I know a lot of what goes in Malaysia, where it is supposed to be a democracy but is anything but.

    In the case of China, it may not be so much corruption but the political system imposed and fairly stringent control over what its citizens can be exposed to.

    Added to the fairly tight familial system means that a cousin of the President is almost certainly going to be at the beg and call of his President … and in relation to Villa that could mean anything, perhaps good or perhaps something else from our point of view.

  79. John Lerwill

    Dr. Xia: “I think attitude is more important than talent. So that is one of the basic principles for me to give advice to the coach to choose players to revamp the team.”

    Going away from the issues of doubt, I thought I’d quote him on a positive observation of his.

  81. steamer

    Just how does Clattenburg get away with it ? and what was red nose doing with him before the game? After Jon Moss’s pathetic performance in last years final, Clattenburg surpassed him. To be fair i haven’t seen a half decent ref in this country for 25 years, the recent ones are a combination of cheats, cowards and incompetents.

  83. Mark King

    Steamer- And not one is Chinese

    Jl- I Signed the one recently about breeding tigers for medicine, this is the kind of pressure that is needed . I’m intrigued to know what differences you have seen in the Chinese? Considering the vast wealth of spiritualism and philosophy that stems from the east why are they so different from say the Indian culture?

    Would you consider approaching the new owner and offering your services ? Especially if a museum is in the offing. I’m sure like me we would all like you to be involved.

  84. John Lerwill

    Mark,

    The difference has developed over the last 70 years, hasn’t it Mark? – The Communist takeover and since.

    Tibet is extremely repressed and many (most?) people in China have dropped their former faiths/beliefs to follow the government’s dictat.

    Not to say that there are no corruption problems in India: there certainly are, but at least the people are allowed freedom to practice what they wish, and always have been.

  85. John Lerwill

    Mark,

    On the Villa museum issue, thank you very much for your kind words. If there was sufficient support for my return I would have to consider it, but I am not looking for it after my previous experience!

  86. Mark King

    Jl- so it’s the freedom of speech etc. Fair enough but business in Russia has softened that stance a little and as I have mentioned the more people are exposed to ideas the more that may change, they cannot keep the world out forever. From my reading of China they have always stayed aloof from the world being big enough to absorb there enemies and carry on as they did with the Mongols .

    Visited Poland recently and they were quite open about their country being built on corruption, part of being under Russian influence for so long I guess.

  87. Mark King

    Jl- maybe it will not fall on such deaf lug holes this time if the money restraints are removed, he doesn’t appear to hang about either. Maybe a word with Carl chinn? Just thinking out loud

  88. John Lerwill

    Mark,

    On the Villa museum, I am disinclined to make any moves at all, to or through anyone. If Carl Chinn were to make that suggestion to Villa, then that would be too nice a gesture on his part for me to refuse if an offer came.

    But there are still one or two relevant management people at VP that would be embarrassed if I were to return!

  89. Jenny Truman

    Morning everyone .

    My reservations Frem are largely based on gut instinct tbf because of the desire to exaggerate qualifications , company ownership , personel connections and achievements . We will say exaggerate some would say deceive .

    It’s been proved that his role in the Bird Nest and other iconic buildings was not as Hollis claimed . So did Hollis make this invent this or was be told.

    The Lotus Foods website published he was a cousin of some notable and the share price went up by 20 per cent the next day – then this claim was removed not to reappear again

    The mix up over what Reclon own perpetrated by Hollis is just plain ridiculous IMO . No wonder the FL and PL have ‘doubts’

    Now the DM article . He wants to prove he’s worth billions by showing the reporter a cheque 🙂 come on . He’s talking about theme parks , museums , when he’s not got his foot through the door . The life long villa fan can’t knows more about Arsenal . The problem with people who are caught out not telling the truth is you wonder what else they’ve lied about .

    If he passes the got and proper test , and buys the club , will he make a good custodian . I’m not so sure he does understand what an English football club is inspite of him saying it’s an important ‘historical ‘ thing to the fans. Because in the next breath he’s excited about changing the name , re randjng it and selling health food from it. An ailing club for an ailing health food business ? Does it work ?

    Finally , if he is worth billions why isn’t he on the Chinese rich list and why has no one ever heard of him .

    I could be wrong of course but let’s say I’m not doing cartwheels of joy !

    If he is serious in his museum plans then John must be chairman 🙂

  90. Mark King

    JL- nothing ventured nothing gained, over to you steamer and ST75 when you see carl 😉 Maybe a book when he becomes owner proper too (if)and a welcome from the best villa blog?

    Jen- The contradictions are annoying but what did we know about Lerner other than the inherited dads money, what is his business? we had a holding company over several companies of which villa were one. I can’t prove it but 500 hundred redundancies at Villa park? more likely those companies being dissolved and who knows what they were at? Business can be very smoke and mirrors. I’m not saying its ideal. I will say this at least he has ambition and ideas and isn’t afraid of voicing them which gives us a heads up if nothing occurs in the near future we can paint his face on a banner and abuse him, we have had practice.

  92. Jenny Truman

    Are you seriously comparing RL with Xai Mark. There was a huge amount of info about Lerner family and its wealth . Rich lists , foundations , family wealth in trusts and ownership of listed and accountable companies . They just don’t compare .
    It’s not ‘annoying’ it’s a deception and therefore disturbing .
    The fact that even the Football League and the Premier League have doubts (who’ve accepted the equivalent of Ronnie Biggs in down the road ) means we should to.

  93. Jenny Truman

    It’s got nothing to do with holding companies as you need to look beyond the holding companies . It’s itrekevant . Look at the companies the holding company owns and what their net worth and returns are . Xai has one company – he was made chairman in 2015 – it made 2 mill profit that year then 50 mill loss the following . Like you say – was this because of the MSG thing .
    Look at the Venkys – had enough money to buy , invest short term , and where are they now ?

  96. Mark King

    Jen- well if he can make a deal for £3.5bil for a company there is money somewhere? If that is a massive fabrication its bold as he has said it in public. The league will surely be looking at that? its not like he can say he didn’t say that is it?

    Lerners holding company has over £300m in capital in it probably shares so how does that work? is that money there to run villa? obviously not, is it money he’s ploughed in probably so we are in a lot of debt is my guess all lerners plus the overdraft.

  98. Jenny Truman

    I’ve read the article Marc and in not sure what it proves . Where you have a group of companies there will be a holding company which doesn’t trade it merely administers and is like the umbrella to unite the group . There’s nothing cloak and daggers about it .

    Exactly , the guy has said he’s paid billions for a company – unless this is an inter co transfer where figures mean nothing (but would be open to inspection in this country at least , I can’t speak for Chinese law ) then he has access to huge funds . I say access as he couid be figure heading .

    My only comfort is the first thing Hollis would have done is say prove you have substance ie you’ve got the money . The errors surrounding this deal is what sends out the red flags as before the birds nest , the mistake over co numbers , the misleading titles , the actual evidence of lotus foods profitability ie 50 mill loss , I was optimistic . Since then Dr Tony appears to be full of talk and outlandish claims and the FL and PL have doubts . Why ? ???

    It is for us as supporters to question as this is the most important transaction in the clubs history . When the deal is done , You won’t see Hollis and co for dust .

    I’m surprised that some villa fans are hanging on dr Tony’s every word (Twitter) and thinking he’s the new Abrmavitch inspite of the well ermmm ‘miscommunications’ He may well be , but I don’t think Abramovitch wd have posed with a big cheque to prove his wealth To the DM

    Maybe Tony is a genius . I hope he is the wealthy benefactor and respector of our club’s history that we need . But we have to ensure he can rescue the club and not let it fall further .

    Beware of Gods bearing gifts ! Check them out first .

  100. Jenny Truman

    got quite excited when I looked on teamax site Marc – thought they owned an amusement park – to find they sell inflatables , false eye lashes , face creams , you name it . That episode on Phoenux Nights with the inflatables came to mind . At least life with Tony won’t be boring

  101. runtings

    the rich don’t like to have all the assets exposed and generally scatter the assets in sub companies and off shore accounts ect

    I get being carious as if the Chinese government are involved in any shape information may be even harder to get

    if he is officially confirmed by the fa then the type of manager brought in and how well he is backed will hopefully give a good indication as to whether we have the real deal or not

  102. Mark King

    I’m not hanging my hat on anything yet Jen don’t worry its all not clear yet thats for sure. On holding companies, seems to me they are just a means of moving money around in a group of companies under one umbrella often staffed by the same people for tax reasons

  106. John Lerwill

    Mark: ” holding companies … are just a means of moving money around in a group of companies under one umbrella often staffed by the same people for tax reasons”

    … and an ideal conduit for the Chinese government to operate through, i.m.o.

  108. Frem

    Jenny- Apparnely in China you don’t have to declare your wealth so may he hasn’t ? He said in the article he likes to keep a low profile, and buying Villa wasn’t the best idea to carry that on 🙂

    Building a museum, fair enough. A theme park, don’t see a throng wrong with that idea. He has money to spare 🙂

    Agree on the info being wrong, that’s weird.

    So apparently Moyes has met with Xia

    Give him the job

  109. Mark King

    Not struck on Moyes myself, the remit is a swift return that could mean second chance for a lot of players if Moyes comes. He’s a bit of perfectionist when it comes to identifying players so unless he has a ready made list of players he wants that will blend with some of ours it will be a testing summer. He’s not a terrible manager but has never got promotion from the champs or won a thing in the prem. He’s a steady eddy choice for me, I’d rather have Pearson.

  110. Jenny Truman

    I should have said beware of Greeks bearing gifts where did gods come from .

    What Xia has to do first is get the right recruitment and scouts ppl in and experienced manager . Raneiri referred to there being excellent systems in place when he arrived at Leicester. He doesn’t have to blow the bank but spend money wisely which is something RL didn’t do.
    David Moyes is ok with me and given his broad experience in running every detail then we need someone like him as the whole set up is shambolic. He will insist on the club getting the basics right before he steps into what could be his last chance saloon appointment of his career .

  111. Paul Pears

    The FA and Premier league investigations are just part of the normal process, before acceptance, and because of the parachute payments due.

    I am sure Hollis and RL would not risk the deal, when a large portion of the payment will only come if certain criteria are met, and Rl would lose heavily.

    Xia and the Recon group are the active part of the deal, and the frontmen, but the Riu Kang are probably the solid financial side, using their government funds, provided by the President Xi.

    Looks as if Moyes is now turning into the main favourite.

  112. Trinity

    People are right to ask questions and be concerned about inconsistencies. I’m pretty sure Dr. X does have more than enough dosh. As for their plans for Villa, especially regards development , I really hope he has the wisdom to listen to football and locals first.
    Saving face is a big thing where he’s from, so I doubt he’ll be splashing money around recklessly. I agree with Jenny on the health food thing at VP. Who goes to a match to buy health food? I’m not so worried about a theme park, though where exactly would it be constructed? Aston is a historical place, but it is a bit depressed these days. Would a theme park be viable?
    Anyway, I think X is just throwing ideas around. He needs to understand that the football side of things comes first. The aim is to win matches. If that happens, then he’ll get some profit and everyone will be happy.

  113. Trinity

    Given Pearson’s accomplishments, he’d be good. Moyes should do a good job, though. Whatever the case, the boss must be backed.
    Get rid of Gabby, N’Zog (gone soon anyway), Richards and other wasters.

  114. Heroes-and-Villans

    Moyes wouldbe a coup. The fear over xia is because we know little, should there be more info? If i had to bet id say he was minted. Willhave more idea come kick off. Lets see what football decisions are made between now and kick off

  117. Frem

    Moyes would be perfect for our ambitions over the next 4 years or so

    But I think it’s been Pearson’s job for a while now

  119. Frem

    My god we are actually giving Samuelson a job. Reading fans hate him

    And Wyness, Everton fans don’t like him either

  120. steamers75

    Jenny .be afraid.be very very very very very very afraid. I will get you a gun and electrify your door knocker.
    Will be in touch tomorrow . Xxxx

  121. Jenny Truman

    St75. You and steamer’s trip to the Columbia cafe is due very soon ! I will find one where we can sit outside .

    Will be doing Zumba tomorrow and Tuesday , salsa Thursday evenings in readiness for villa lifers meet up and Mexico ! Oh and when Lionel Ritchie invited me on stage next month . Well I can dream X

  125. Heroes-and-Villans

    hmmm to be fair it’s all sounding a bit dodgy. Maybe learner wants to stitch us up just to look good!

    I dont reall understand the finance side of things so just judge it on the footy front. If we got Moyes and a new squad id be very happy whoever was in charge

  126. Jenny Truman

    From the Daily Telegraph business correspondent in Bejing . http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/05/23/questions-linger-over-new-chinese-owner-of-aston-villa/

    This is what DT have found out about Xia and his past businesses. The false titles , false certificates , misrepresentations won’t go away . Criticism from Chinese minister of trade also worrying . Then we have Samuelson who Has allegedly been involved in fraudulent activity and dodgy loans a plenty .
    Why is he involved? There’s more twists and red herrings to this than an Inspectir Poirot novel . Nothing is ever simple st the Villa 🙂

  132. Paul Pears

    Thanks for that link Jenny. Would love to chat to Bill Kenwright, and find out a little more.

    The more and more you delve into Russian and Chinese money, the more likely you are liable to find smoke screens, as they do not want their people to realise that they are more corrupt than the original aristocracy’s that ruled them. Any personal wealth has to seem as if they have earned it, and not just shuffled bits of paper about.

    Maybe Van Gal will be knocking on our door next…

    There are of the old Serpentine grounds and other tracts of land being developed , or up for sale around Villa Park, and Tony Xia could easily set up a major theme park, with attractions that would draw the Chinese in large numbers to the area, with the excellent motorway connections offering superb travel connections. this would also majorly improve Birmingham’s standing world wide, if it can at least match the likes of Disneyland Paris.

    What is not in contention is Recon’s involvement in developing cities across China.

  133. Paul Pears

    The commercial land around Villa Park could well be some of the cheapest in any major city and is really ripe for any development company to swallow up, and turn it into a huge development plan, with its close proximity to road, rail and air links to the rest of Europe.

    It also has Star City, with its attractions, including the Genteng Casino, on its doorstep, and could easily have the new tramways extended to Villa Park, as they once were before.

  134. Heroes-and-Villans

    its a big blow moyesy rejecting us. And gets the takeover off to a negative start. I thought it was meant to be all better when randy left.

    Also going to throw up more questions why he rejected us. Lets hope its because he didnt fancy the champ.

    The negativity in the press and things being unclear really needs for hollis or xia to clear it all up.

  135. Paul Pears

    It is a pity we do not still have the visionary forefathers of the old Birmingham, who built the dams in Wales, produced all their own power companies, bank and many other fantastic achievements, as today, they would have done this development from city funds, and the profits would have been returned to the city.

    In more recent times, they did of course do the same with the NEC, but now that has all gone, and we no longer have these people creating the same exciting developments for the people of the city.

  136. Jenny Truman

    Baffles me why ppl expect Moyes to agree to work for a club whose ownership is still up in the air . If Tony fails the F and P test he’s left with the old guard . What assurances can they give on spending etc . It’s a nonsense . why are they making announcements like this . Mgrs want to know how much they can spend , particularly when promotion is the goal . AVFC can’t confirm this yet .

  137. runtings

    if it is true that moyes was the no.1 choice and turned it down then that is worrying

    however it may not be true – -moyes has not won anything not even promotion so what qualify s him ahead of the likes of person who has won promotion which that team now crown champions of England

    hopefully its all just paper talk

  138. southwestvillan

    Worrying times about the takeover Moyes has distanced himself from AVFC for whatever reasons, too many questions left unanswered about our Tony and his wealth and connections, could Hollis have been duped by his advisors, I just get this feeling that the takeover might just fall through and we are back to square one.
    We are cursed I am sure of it nothing ever goes right for us, lots of question marks about these new board members, I just ain”t liking any of it.

    SWV

  139. Paul Pears

    Good piece on news now from Sebsb.com about private ownership and Tony Xia.

    Tony Xia has held discussions with Moyes, but it may be that Moyes did not live up to the expectations of Xia, and now Pearson remains the firm favourite, which is the fans choice.

    It would seem from the Daily Mail sources that there is no question over Xia’s wealth.

  140. B6toBrasil

    Hi PP,Jenny,SWV……this fella looks dodgier by the day.You either have the funds or you don’t.Why lie about qualifications?My main concern is that we are woefully underprepared for the coming season,all this is taking time….which we don’t have.
    Tony was probably very wealthy a couple of weeks ago….but house hunting in Brum he went for a session with S75 and Steamer…..skint now and in debt.

  141. southwestvillan

    B62B,

    How is it in the land of nuts, yep Tony is looking extremely dodgy, can you believe Ellison was in the running as well and we turned him away, is it possible to have three crap owners on the bounce only at Villa Park, you just knew the nightmare was just taking a hiatus.

    SWV

  142. steamer

    B6B,
    Easiest 20 quid St75 ever made.
    To be honest the whole thing is getting boring and the club is becoming an even bigger laughing stock than it was last season.
    To turn down Oracle was ridiculous, you know where you stand with them, you don’t with these and if Samuelson is passed by the FA then i’ll vote to stay in EEC ( not really ).
    Hope PP is right about TX being OK because i cant see Oracle coming back after being rejected.

  146. steamer

    Apparently they were second and the third bidders were from the UK.

    Richards and Lescott must be disappointed about their non-selection for England after Stones and Smalling got in, as for Wheelchair, Sterling and Henderson, why waste shirts ?

  147. runtings

    what a mistrusting lot we are on here

    the new owner seems awesome in my view thus far

    he has done gord knows how many interviews with the UK media and seems to be leaving no stone unturned before choosing a manager
    i have read that dr x sent his reps to interview the candidates and it wouldn’t surprise me if they have come to the same conclusion as myself and the likes of steamer about Moyes which is (he aint our man)

    i have more optimism than not at the moment – hopefully i am proved right and we have our villa back

  148. B6toBrasil

    Hi Runtingz,I have me fingers crossed that all turns out well.I just wish he(TONY) had kept his pie hole firmly closed until the deal and himself had been approved.
    SO far he seems to talk a good game,lets see what he does.I just want to see the prep for the new season start asap.I would rather the deal fell through now rather than have financial difficulties and criminal investigations in the months and years ahead.Its one thing to have the ££££££ to purchase the club,but can he bankkroll the repair and rebuild that is required?

  149. John Lerwill

    Runtings,

    I’m with you in your aspiration, but please – just for safety’s sake – don’t hope for anything too much – yet.

    As has been hinted at before, anything that RL has been associated with has – to date – been scuppered by his type of approach to business.

    Sadly, I feel that Hollis has been un-nerved by the departures from the board and wants to get out himself a.s.a.p.. And he has shown some misapprehension already in the Dr. X saga.

    Taking all that into account – and while waiting the findings of the PL and FL – we’d best be going off on a summer holiday with Cliff Richard for a few weeks! 😉

  150. runtings

    hi brazil
    yes the are as many questions as answers right now – especially were money is concerned but for me if you are dealing with possible Chinese government ownership then don’t expect access to there accounts
    one thing seems sure is that the new owners have great ambitions for the clubs future — and we know the Chinese are the most successful nation when it comes to new and recent business – they don’t like failure or to loose face — with all the bold statement that have been made i expect good times ahead

  151. runtings

    agree JL – nothing is written in stone – i however remain more optimistic than sceptical – and until i know any different for sure i am gonna enjoy the ride and the dream and visions tony has talked about

  154. Godfrey

    Jenny,

    I share your misgivings.

    For the club’s sake and all the loyal Villa fans out there, I really hope that we are both totally wrong about Tony Xia.

    Putting all else to one side, you would imagine that somebody who had only ever seen Villa play once in his life would be able to tell the interviewer the name of the opposing team that day.

    Don’t rely on the FA and Football League’s Fit and Proper check to halt the deal and leave us with a China Crisis.

    UTV

  157. B62 Villa

    Well it seems conjecture , rumour, conspiracy rumours and good old fashioned guesswork are the order of the day where Villa and the new owners are concerned. It’s a blow that Moyes has turned us down, I’m not convinced it’s entirely down to the new owner as much as the fact we are a championship team in need of open heart surgery, and there are higher profile jobs available. Although the media are now speculating Pearson will follow suit and snub us,!! WTF have we done to deserve this chaos, it’s never ending.
    We need it all sorting out ASAP, as the new manager has only got 2 months or so until we start our league campaign. RDM is still being heavily linked although Martinez name has cropped up( please NO). This shows how far our stock has fallen, once we were after Lobster now we struggle with fish fingers.

  158. steamer

    The Lerner years have left an awful stench over VP, when second raters like Moyes turn us down it makes you wonder what sort of player will be attracted to B6 ?
    If Hollis can be ( possibly ) fooled by the fiasco surrounding TX then i don’t think the FA will discover any problems with either his character or finances or even those of his collegues, i doubt if these dummies would find fault if Hitler wanted to buy a club and others have failed the test and still bought clubs.
    Looks like another shambles of a pre-season ahead, this club never ceases to amaze me.

  159. James Gill

    Moyes is finished,two massive failures in a row,we need a strong manager that can make a decision about players fast Moyes would dither about,plus as a scotch man the villa fans wouldn’t be able to give him some time black Lambert McLeish and mcneil

  160. steamer

    Chap on TBAR was talking to Lee Hendrie on Sunday and asked if the takeover was going Carson Yeung, Hendrie laughed and said it was “The big one.” Hope that allays some fears.

  162. Paul Pears

    Have come to realise that all the reporters for most of papers, especially local ones, have no more knowledge, insight, or information, than the average football fan, and in some cases are not as intelligent.

    Moyes has turned the Villa down due to private talks with Bill Kendrick, although the new money at Everton, would prefer a much bigger name.

    Didn’t realise that Wyness is a local boy and went to Tudor Grange.

  166. runtings

    Thought i would lighten the mood on here amongst all the depressing stuff there is good news
    Dwight Yorke is so up for the manager vacancy
    contain yourself steamer

  168. Frem

    RDM. Ugh. Another manager obsessed with 1 up top and crowing the midfield. No thanks

    As Kristina said

    ” WE NEED FUCKING WINGERS”

  169. Paul Pears

    The Asian world, reading your link Runtings, continues to understand China’s desire to become a major global power in the world of soccer, so for the moment, all should be to the advantage of Villa fans, however years down the line, it may be very different, but for the time, they will be pouring money in…..

  170. Trinity

    Paul
    She’ll be right, mate. I think you are right. In the long term things will be different. In the meantime if Dr. X can get the club back to winning ways…

  171. Paul Pears

    I am reading that Xia and his people are keen on Brian Little, and he is now desperate to be part of the new set-up, so maybe he will become Director of Football, which would be a great move with the fans.

  172. Trinity

    Paul/Frem
    Be great to have Brian Little at the club in a dof capacity. If it is RDM to be manager, he might be more receptive to a DoF because RDM won’t be able to bring all his preferred assistants, anyway. I think Pearson would get on with BL too, but won’t be as receptive to his ideas. BL likes traditional wingers I’d say. Attacking fullbacks only work if you’ve got guys who can really defend first and then centre the ball accurately. Pearson won’t take any nonsence, but either would BL. Xia would be mad not to bring him on board.

  173. Heroes-and-Villans

    Does anyone else get a bad/funny feeling when watching the dr interview? The guy has been in the uk and usa living and working but his english is pretty poor for a genius! Cant put my finger on it but something does not come across right.

    Apparently he is the guy west brom stopped dealing with when he tried to buy them

  174. DarrenO

    My initial thoughts and comments on here were more in relief of the changing of the guard, while there are internet warriors out there ready to proclaim we have Carson Yeung Mark 2. I think it’s not that bad but clarity is required.

    All of us including myself are clutching at straws to back our own point of view. RL passed the fit and proper test and looked what happened. We have no power in this other than to judge by the actions of the new owner, he’s not had a chance to make a single decision yet so talk is cheap.

    My own feeling on it is Tony Xia is the face for the Chinese government, they can’t be seen to be directly investing in ‘foreign’ football because i’m sure their local clubs would demand similar investment, I believe AVFC is the vehicle the Chinese government is using to expand into football world dominance. Tony Xia himself may be rich but not billionaire rich but it’s his backers that will need to go thru the ‘fit and proper test’.

    Hollis for all the criticism I laid at his door for having no football knowledge, is not stupid when it comes to business deals nor is the Socfin group.

    Proof will be in the pudding so lets put the guns back in their holsters until we have some evidence.

    Separately, I was on FB yesterday and already the Lerner back brigade has a membership of 1 who excused him for making honest mistakes and trusting the wrong people, worse still he was also called Darren (oh the shame)

  176. Jenny Truman

    Morning all.

    Whatever the truth about Tony Xia we really need to kick on (dreadful choice I know ) with pre season games (are there any – tour – manager – recruitment – manager ! .

    At least Tony has identified in the five mins he’s been here that relegation was mostly the responsibility of the scouts and “recruitment needs strengthening “. His exact words even though Bham Mail reports he is going to sack Riley . hopefully sooner rather than later.

    DeM : Xia’s choice from the start . Maybe he’s impressed by champions league winner in his cv (when we know it was his strong connections with Chelsea players that got him over the line ) or maybe his experience of getting a team promoted . I’m happy whichever it is . It’s not going to be easy recruiting a decent manager for championship and when club is relatively uncertain due to new ownership .

  177. Jenny Truman

    Darren . Villa fans are cautious because of the mess other clubs have found themselves in : Leeds, Blackburn , SHA etc. It’s reasonable to want to know as much as possible about a new owner who could make or break any football club however big. It’s been made worse by AV publishing incorrect info about him . I truly hope he is the real deal and makes us into the top 3 club in the world. At least he has ambition !!! None of this retaining premier league status mediocrity !! 🙂

  178. Jenny Truman

    I saw that John . I hope he gets deM – but I still think Pearson is contender unless , his fall out (and son’s escapades) with the Thai owners at Leicester is concerning Tony .

  179. steamer

    The Telegraph article should calm a few nerves.
    Read somewhere that Pearson has turned us down so that limits us to some mediocre talents possibly foreign although he seems determined to get RdM.
    Delighted if Brian Little stays, one of the great Villa loyalists as well as a wonderful player and decent human being.

  181. southwestvillan

    Yes Yorke the Villa legend the one who loved the fans and the club until Untied came knocking and then it was a case of I’m off, couldn’t get up the M6 quick enough, tosser.

    Still unsure about our Tony how could the club get so much information about his past dealings so wrong surely they must have done their homework or has someone been misled, every article you read tends to contradict the other, he is a billionaire but no he is worth millions, he is backed by the Chinese government but we have no evidence of this, one of his companies made a major loss last financial year, has he taken on the Villa debt or has Randy written it off.
    There are just too many questions that remain unanswered, will Little be part of the new structure what will the board consist of, when will the PL/FL finally publish their findings, surely we cannot employ a new manager until the takeover is rubber stamped.

    With every delay the start of next season looms ever closer with a group of players nowhere near good enough to play conference football let alone fight their way out of the championship.

    Are we convinced with RDM if I had to be honest he would not be my choice but with all others not fancying the job we may not have a choice, I remember when the Villa job became available every manager in the land would apply, those days have definitely gone.
    The next two weeks are going to be torture for us Villans hold onto to your hats I think this is going to be a bumpy ride.

    SWV

  183. runtings

    Morning all

    It seems the British press reports a far less favourable re the takeover than the Asian and other foreign sources
    My reading into the whole thing is still we have struck gold — not to say i am right in that of course

    I like the fact that Tony says the fans were fantastic at the Arsenal game
    A bloke at work was at that game and says the villa fans are amazing
    if i had a penny for the amount of times i have heard that this season i wouldn’t have to go to work.

    Not at all excited about RDM and think Pearson is the outstanding candidate

    i would like to think the press are talking rubbish in saying he doesn’t want the job – if that is true then maybe people are correct in thinking we have been sold to a mickey mouse outfit – but i don’t believe that is the case

    can’t wait for this FPP formality to be dealt with so we can get on with the business of sorting out a squad that is fit for purpose

    VTID

  185. southwestvillan

    Runtings,

    Blimey mate you hoped over that fence a few times there, unfortunately if Tony is not all he claims to be and takes over then it will be too late, he seems to have been able to dupe Hollis so he may be able to do the same to the PL/FL with a bit of slight of hand.

    To be fair to Ellison and Oracle what you see is what you get but the Chinese lot seemed to be shrouded in lots of mystery, this could be a good thing but sometimes if it seems too good to be true then it probably is, being a Villan and optimistic go together like curry and custard, we live in hope that we are not about to land in a very big frying pan or should I say Wok.

    SWV

  186. southwestvillan

    Trin,

    That seems to be a long way off:
    1) Wait for PL/FL approval.
    2) Finalise takeover.
    3) Appoint Manager.
    4) Assess squad ( find out they are crap )
    5) Sell said crap players.
    6) Find replacements.
    7) Try to get new squad together for pre-season/season start.
    8) Get off to a flying start otherwise Tony might pull the trigger.
    Invade China and take over the world so that AVFC is in the top three on the planet.

    Might just email this to Tone it actually sounds like a plan.

    SWV
    0

  188. steamer

    Thinking about TX and the takeover, if it really is a flop then the Chinese government wouldn’t exactly be ecstatic with him and they’d lose a considerable amount of prestige after announcing their intention to dominate football so IMO its a case of he must succeed and we’ll put a fortune in his hands to make certain he does.

  191. runtings

    Awesome steamer – not much more tony can do now to convenience people but i do think we should not be overly critical unless we have genuine reason to be

    he said more in that interview than Randy said in close to a decade — really excited about the future

  193. steamer

    The vermin are in good hands, quotes by current knob –

    “Birmingham City is a big club.”
    “One thing we know as management is that we want to keep our dignity on and off the pitch.”
    “Because as everyone knows, this is Birmingham City one of the most historic clubs in England.”

    Always good for a laugh.

  197. John Lerwill

    Runtings: “not much more tony can do now to convenience people “

    I think you’re right. His persistent willingness to be there communicating (it’s a crying shame that his English is not brilliant), and the way in which he does it, shows clearly he’s not phased by the scepticism there has been this past week.

    So I’m coming round to thinking that he is a good guy. If he hadn’t been trying to communicate so much I would still be sceptical, but he’s placated me. A refreshing change after RL.

  198. B6toBrasil

    I applaud Tony,as I do anyone, who tries to communicate in a language that is not their mother tongue.In fact he is more coherent than both McShambles and McMumble.
    He cmlearly believes in communicating with us,this is a very refreshing change.
    It doesn’t require a high IQ to work out where we will be going for pre season tours in the future.
    The radio stations are saying RDM is nailed on.In the short term I think we need a 3 season man,and Pearson is my preference,but if it’s RDM,then I support him and wish him well.

  201. Mark King

    I think he is surprised by the level of scrutiny but as you all have said he’s stood up and talked not hid behind the likes of Fox ETC, bodes well in my book

  202. Heroes-and-Villans

    Haha b6 very true, speaks better english than lambo and mcleish.

    I dont mind rdm but will need a new squad, his own players in. This lot might bully him. Does not seem the ruthless segeant major type.

  205. DarrenO

    “I want to communicate with fans as much as I can, to win their hearts back to this great club.”

    This says it all for me, clearly he’s looked at what has happened and the disconnect between the club and fan unlike Small Heath where all he’d have to do is arrange a taxi to take them to the game, TX starts off with 1000s of supporters willing to back him and it’s probably the longer term fans who fell away under Lerner that need to be enticed back and only what happens on the pitch will do that.

    Agree with the sentiment that Pearson as a sargeant major would be great for the current squad but I expect it will be RDM and with his own players and the bad eggs will be gone before season starts, they brought us down without caring, i don’t see them caring about bringing us back up regardless of what they may say thru the OS in the coming months.

    We had exciting times under MON, I expect to outstrip those days knowing someone is in control of the budget spend and contract/salary details.

    Proud History, New Future

  207. southwestvillan

    Still finding it hard to get excited at the moment, I remember how I felt when Lerner took over from Ellis and we all know how that turned out, still too many unanswered questions for my liking, and as for Tony blimey we heard from Lerner twice in ten years so far Tony has done ten interviews in two days and he still has not been officially vetted, and he likes to keep a low profile ffs.

    I am not a doom monger but I prefer the wait and see approach.

    SWV
    诶 维 艾弗西

    艾丝 豆贝尔维 维

  210. steamer

    So Okore expects Premier Division football next season does he ? he’s crepe, no-where near good enough in any department of the game, it wasn’t only Black who left him out.

  211. James Gill

    This is nearly worse than relegation,the waiting,please hurry up get formalities done and dusted,new manager,biggest giveaway ever buy one get two free,ie Richards get lescott and gabby thrown in,or rolled in, in gabby case.
    We need
    Keeper
    Right back
    Centre half
    Two centre mids at least one over 6 f 2 I
    Striker
    Much like remi wanted
    To add to
    Bunn sarkic
    Cissko amavi we need cissko to amavi fit
    Clark captain give okore one more chance toner
    Gana vertout
    Adamq grealish
    Rudi
    The rest of older players sell,release

  215. Heroes-and-Villans

    Good posts lads, great reads. Also saw a post that recon are involved in space missions and are worth 100 billion!!!

    Looks like rdm the man. Ok with me, was surprised when baggies sacked him and has done well at dhelsea and schalke. Bringing newton with him from chelsea which is good. My worry is that it reads he is preferred be because of his name in china etc. Not a sound way of choosing a new manager for a re build. Would of thought pearson or moyes ahead of him. Also prem looking into xia employing directors, not happy. Take it its samuelson

  216. B6toBrasil

    Okore…jog on son…I have supported Villa by birth and love since 1957.So you going,staying or retiring ,concerns me as about as much as what shoe size you are.This club means everything to me,you are insignificant and mediocre…….we will still be here long after you kiss the badge at some second tier team in Croatia.Jog on.

  217. Jenny Truman

    And the moon is made of cheese Andrew 🙂
    I’m just a miserable cynic haha . But it makes great reading . At least we are not boring like the baggies 🙂 Wait to see if Dr Tony wears his football shirt tucked in his trousers like Tan did . Seems the FL don’t like the inclusion of some shady characters who are allegedly big in money laundering . Why not ? It’s never bothered them before !!!
    This TO has been the best entertainment we’ve had for years !!!!

  218. Trinity

    At least we’re getting some optimism back, and not thinking about how much we’ll lose by in the weekend. Sounds like the new manager will be appointed within 2-3 days.

  220. steamers75

    Trinity
    Remember Grasshopper ?? we had him playing for us years ago , his name was Chang , steamer will remember him , used to put his foot on steamers head and tie his boots up , , went to Tibet for years and came back all kung fu ee . dangerous . touched a player and he couldn’t move , his son is now playing /scoring for Walsall.
    jeeez fucking some of these villa fans on some of the fb pages and blogs are fucking arses , lm just waiting till it goes through or gets kicked out , not falling for all the hype , no one knows what the fuck is going on and those reading the media and taking it as gospel need a reality check , some twats are even calling for leaner back !! FFS .
    well lm going up’t town see some some coffin dodgers from my days growing up in small heath at the Old Royal Pub , hopefully steamer comes , (we can go visit swordfish records first mate )
    have a good weekend all
    Jenny XXXXXXXX . will get swivel hips steamer to show you his moves when we come down ))) xxx

  224. Jenny Truman

    Haha – steamer – yes the irony 🙂 true Marc

    I’d never heard of the grasshopper Trin – but I know that Leicester do have meditation and similar things .

    Just to clarify , the swivel hips that St75 is talking about is my salsa lessons – which we have been laughing about cos in the class video they all look like extras from crime watch and Phoenix Nights. 🙂

  226. Mark King

    As the Vultures circle we will find out what ambition the club has. Clark seems to be in demand and if he goes for £5m It will mean to me we are not that minted. If on the other hand they tell him sorry pal you are under contract and the manager says you stay or they hold out until we get £8-10m for him then we will know we have a regime that is not governed solely by whats on offer if it doesn’t suit our plans

    I remember a Chinese lad that turned up at school, a real nice lad and was a gymnast and could sprint like Linford. One of the wannabe tough lads thought he could win some points with his mates by picking on him, funniest thing I have ever seen, he got absolutely battered

  227. James Gill

    As for new manager the main thing is recruitment,4 men tried and failed with paddy Riley buys,as for players looking to move after last season who will want them,one season in championship has to be a gamble worth risking for better players

  228. John Lerwill

    Mark,

    That Mail link gives a really +ve insight, doesn’t it?

    While not yet getting excited (because of the PL/FL pending assessment), I’m feeling this may well be an owner who has genuinely got the right perspective on AVFC.

    It’s exactly where I thought we should be in 2009 and when they all went chicken. Six wasted years since.

  229. steamer

    JL,
    I agree with that.

    Hope TX buys Blose…………….. and closes the toerags down, only cost him 7m but he’d gain so much respect ……. and a car park.

  230. southwestvillan

    ST75,

    I remember Keith Chang really well a real nice bloke and never looked the type who could kill you with one punch, I am with you very pessimistic about this takeover very much a waiting brief.

    SWV

  231. runtings

    Looks like it’s definitely RDM then

    I can’t realy join the sceptics re tony’s takeover — I have read and heard more than enough to have no doubt our new owner not only has fund most clubs can only dream of but the ambition to succeed and make the club great again

    when you see the fella being interviewed by specialist financial tv news programmes it hit home that this fella is far from a blagger

  233. Trinity

    runtings
    They were great shows. “Everybody was a kung fu fighting”in those days. Remember all those Kung Fu movies at the pictures? We all thought Bruce Lee was indestructable, couldn’t believe he died, thought it was a scam.
    I think Dr.X will come through. Masterr Po says time will tell:)

  234. Mark King

    Just read xia has 40% of the digital market in china. Thats a huge market share and tinternet is going through the roof over there at the moment. If true happy days.

  236. Heroes-and-Villans

    far to early to get excited. 1 The rumoured board set up seems a bit dodgy. 2. RDM would of been at best my 3rd choice manager. 4 takeover still no done. 5 current players still there :(. No idea what Xia is worth still and dont really understand what the buying of another footy team would mean….just think it may prove he has serious cash.

    Will get behing RDM but until takeover is done and we do some serious work on the squad ill reserve judgement

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